Today and yesterday during committee stage for Bill 36: Miscellaneous Statutes Amendment Act (No. 3) a debate ensued regarding the process by which college and university boards are populated. I provided some further detail in my second reading speech.

The first three sections of the bill dealt with streamlining the process of board appointees for staff and faculty representatives. Initially, I had some questions about the rationale for these changes and so I sought a briefing from the Ministry. It turned out that the changes brought British Columbia in line with what is already in place in every other province in the country other than Alberta.

The official opposition (BC Liberals) were relentless in their attack on the Minister by suggesting that somehow the proposed amendments were enabling conflict of interest situations to arise. The Minister was somewhat testy in her response to many of the questions and I felt that a more thorough unpacking of the issue was warranted.

Below I provide the text and videos of the exchange which occurred over the span of two days.

You’ll notice in this exchange that I turn the conversation into identifying what I believe is a very real problem with the governance of colleges and universities in British Columbia. That is, I note that British Columbia is unique in Canada wherein all of its college and university boards are dominated by Order in Council (i.e. government) appointments.

The independence of college and university boards is critical. These institutions are places that allow for innovation and creativity to flourish. They’re not places for government to facilitate a top down imposition of its ideology. Unfortunately, under existing legislation the government has the potential to interfere in ways that could undermine their autonomy. That is why I have twice introduced a private members bill aimed at rectifying this situation.

I will continue to pressure government to adopt the proposed governance changes identified in this private members bill.

Text of Exchange (October 3)

A. Weaver: Now, I do appreciate the official opposition questioning and the line of questioning. I would suggest that there seems to be a misunderstanding, a fundamental one, as to how colleges and institutions operate in the province of British Columbia, which I would have expected not to have occurred in light of the fact that they have been in government for 17 years.

Please let me go through a series of questions. We’re clearly not going to make it though today. But the first question is with respect to section 1. I do realize that there’s been some kind of flow-over in sections 1, 2 and 3 when issues with respect to Royal Roads and universities have been discussed. So I ask some lenience, here, of the Chair. I will focus initially on the colleges and institutes.

My first question to the minister is: could she please describe the existing makeup of boards of governors as outlined in the College and Institute Act?

Hon. M. Mark: For the college boards, they’re composed of eight or more persons appointed by the Lieutenant-Governor-in-Council — one person on the faculty of the institution and elected by the faculty members, two students elected by the students, one person who is part of the support staff and elected by the support staff, the president, and the chair of the education council of the college.

I’ll add that the board of the Justice Institute of B.C. is slightly different. It consists of eight or more persons appointed by the Lieutenant-Governor-in-Council, and the president.

A. Weaver: Now, this is where it gets a little bit…. I was just wondering — just for the sake of clarity and comparison, not dealing with section 3 but here — if the minister could say what the makeup of the board of the University of British Columbia is?

Hon. M. Mark: I feel like I need to say this really quickly so that we can get out of here on time.

The board of governors of the University of British Columbia is composed of 21 members in order to reflect that it has two campuses: the chancellor; the president; a faculty member who works at UBC Okanagan, elected by faculty members who work at UBC Okanagan; two faculty members who work at UBC Vancouver, elected by faculty members who work at UBC Vancouver; 11 persons appointed by the Lieutenant-Governor-in-Council, two of whom are to be appointed from among persons nominated by the alumni association; a student who studies at UBC Okanagan, elected from students who are members of a student society and study at UBC Okanagan; two students who study at UBC Vancouver, elected by students who are members of a student society and study at UBC Vancouver; one person who works at UBC Okanagan, elected by and from employees who are not faculty and work at UBC Okanagan; and finally, one person who works at UBC Vancouver, elected by and from employees who are not faculty and work at UBC Vancouver.

A. Weaver: Would it be true, then, if I made the statement…? This is a question to the minister. In every case, in every college and institute — Royal Roads — and university in the province of British Columbia, the composition of each board has more order-in-council appointments than it does elected members of the university.

Hon. M. Mark: Yes.

A. Weaver: Could the minister please describe any other province in the country of Canada for which there are more order-in-council appointments at the university level over the elected or other members from the institution?

Hon. M. Mark: I don’t have the detailed information in front of me at this moment, but I can get the information to the member.

A. Weaver: We’ll be resuming this later, and I would hope we can start the questioning with this.

I do note the hour, and I move that we rise and report progress.

Text of Exchange (October 4)

A. Weaver: Yesterday we left off with a question that the minister had suggested she would be able to provide the answer for: the question I had asked as to what other provinces in our country have boards that are comprised of more order-in-council appointments than those elected by or participating in the institutions. I’m hoping she has the answer this morning to share with us.

Hon. M. Mark: Thank you to the member for the question. There are a few examples in other provinces where, like British Columbia, LGIC appointees have a majority over non-appointed members. But across the country, the number of government appointees to university boards generally do not exceed the number of non-appointed members.

For example, the University of Manitoba has 12 appointed members, three of which must be students, and 11 non-appointed members. At Memorial University of Newfoundland, they have a majority of 21 appointed members, four of whom are students, and nine are non-appointed members.

A. Weaver: I appreciate the very few examples that exist. It’s interesting to note in those examples that exist that the appointed members are, indeed, also comprising students. So British Columbia is rather unique in the number. And as the minister pointed out yesterday, in the colleges act, there is a boardroom made up of one elected faculty member, two elected students, one staff elected, one president, one chair of the education council and eight appointments through order-in-council — at least eight.

My question is to the minister. Does she believe that students are in a conflict of interest if they are on a board, in light of the fact that it is the board that determines tuition fee increases? Yes or no?

Hon. M. Mark: The response is no, but there are bylaws and measures in place to address any conflicts of interest. Again, through the board, there are some institutions where students are allowed to participate in the room. There are institutions where they’re not. The test of conflict of interest is always being measured. Again, the law, the act, states to act in the best interests of the institutions.

A. Weaver: Every college in the province and every university in the province has students on its boards. Those students are elected, and those students are governed by conflict-of-interest proceedings and regulations as outlined by the minister. So I very much appreciate that answer.

In the same vein, of the staff and faculty that are on all boards, everyone, as is noted by the minister, is elected. The question I then have is: how are order-in-council appointments made? Who actually makes those appointments?

Hon. M. Mark: Orders-in-council are approved by cabinet at the recommendation of the minister. As the member knows, there are hundreds, if not thousands, of appointments that are made across all ministries throughout government.

A. Weaver: On these boards, some of the institutions…. We’ve had some leeway in these discussions because sections 1 to 3 are virtually identical in scope. They just apply to three different things: College and Institute Act, Royal Roads Act and University Act. The official opposition and I have been a little loose across the references, but it’s all bearing on the same theme.

My question is: how is a chancellor appointed at a university, and how does a board appoint the chancellor?

Hon. M. Mark: Thank you for the question. Under the University Act, “chancellor,” defined under section 11, part 5: “There must be a chancellor of each university, who is to be appointed by the board on nomination by the alumni association and after consultation with the senate or, in the case of the University of British Columbia, after consultation with the council.

A. Weaver: The chancellor is the public face and the representative of an institution. The chancellor, as noted by the minister, is elected by the board. The government appoints the majority in British Columbia on all boards of colleges, Royal Roads and universities.

Does the minister believe that there’s a potential conflict of governance if it is the government that ultimately, through its appointments and dominance in all of the boards actually determines the voice of an institution? This is unique in British Columbia, unlike any other province in our nation — that the government appointees make up dominance of the boards, who then select the chancellor, who is the public institution. This is why we’ve had scandal after scandal in British Columbia, most recently at the University of British Columbia and also UNBC, with respect to appointments.

My question to the minister is this. Is she concerned that the conflict of interest that actually arises in the appointment of the boards in British Columbia is not through the elected people who are on the board but rather by the potential for government to influence the academic governance of a board by stacking the boards with their party elite? Does this concern the minister at all? And the subsequent question: is this an issue that she believes could lead to conflict of interest with government?

Hon. M. Mark: I do agree with the member that elected members are not in a conflict. However, the broader discussion of an appointment of a chancellor is, with all due respect, out of the scope of the discussion today with the amendments that we have on the floor. I am happy to discuss the bigger picture of the amendments that I am aware — which the member opposite has raised — need to be changed.

I’ve heard from other stakeholders what areas might need to be changed under the University Act or under the College and Institute Act, but with respect to what is on the floor today, we are proposing amendments to section 59, part 8 about the eligibility of appointed members to the board that are elected faculty or staff.

A. Weaver: I’m fine with that answer, actually. I’ll come back to that.

I have two more questions.

My question to the minister is this: to what extent do these proposals conflict or agree with similar legislation that exists in every other province across this nation?

Hon. M. Mark: The only other province that has similar legislation is currently Alberta. Through these amendments, the only province that will have those rules in effect will be Alberta. So we will be bringing ourselves in line with every other province in Canada.

A. Weaver: That concludes my line of questioning, and I very much appreciate the response from the minister and her staff.

To summarize what has happened here is that we’ve realized and had a full discussion as to the makeup of these boards, how there are certain elected members, which is comparative to other provinces. In fact, where we differ is we have so many order-in-council appointments here, whereas they have the majority on each and every board.

I appreciate that the minister pointed out that this is not the subject of today. But what I’ve tried to point out through this line of questions is that the amendments that are put forward here are not actually controversial. They’re in place already across the nation in virtually every other province except Alberta.

But Alberta is also quite different from B.C. because in Alberta, they do not have order-in-council appointments dominating the boards. So B.C. really is an outlier in this. We have, if I would suggest— I’d like to discuss this further with the minister, and I look forward to those discussions —— that if there is any conflict of interest in the boards, it’s not with the elected students. It’s not with the elected faculty. It’s not with the elected staff. It’s actually with the order-in-council appointments wherein government can actually have its agenda imposed on an institution by appointing the board, both in terms of the selection of the chancellor, who is the public face, as well as the governance within the programs in the institution.

That is very dangerous in a democratic society where we rely on the free exchange of ideas. British Columbia is unique.

I support this section wholeheartedly, as somebody who spent a lifetime in universities, as somebody who served as a chief negotiator for the faculty association, as somebody who couldn’t do that and be on the board — because there’s no time — as someone who supports the electoral process that puts students, faculty and staff on the boards, as someone who supports the governance of institutions in a free and democratic society but actually has very real problems with what is happening, again, in British Columbia, the Wild West, where order-in-council appointments dominate boards, potentially leading to — and in some cases, demonstrably leading to — decisions being made that are government-related that actually impinge upon the academic freedom of an institution.

With that, I thank the minister and her staff for the attention of the questions that I put forward.

Videos of Exchange